057: Working With A Writing Coach + Writing Historical Fiction With Layla Essary
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Working With A Writing Coach + Writing Historical Fiction With Layla Essary
Katie Wolf 0:24
All right, everyone. Welcome to a special episode of the Blank Page to Book podcast after a number of solo shows, I've decided to bring on my first ever guest. And I'm very, very excited to be talking to Layla Essary today, she's a writer and author and one of my coaching clients, Layla, thanks so much for being here, excited to chat with you.
Layla Essary 0:54
I'm so honored that you let me come on and that this is your first guest, I really feel like that is such a great opportunity. And it's been a fun experience. And so I'm excited to get to talk about it.
Katie Wolf 1:06
Yes, I'm excited for everyone to hear about it and to hear about your book, too. So just as an intro, do you want to tell us a little bit about yourself and a little bit about the book that you've written?
Layla Essary 1:16
Yeah, so I've been a lifetime writer, I've been a journalist and broadcast journalist for, and newspaper journalist in the past, and I'm a consultant right now I do a lot of writing for my work. But this was since my English major days back in college, this is probably one of my really more intentional, you know, deep dives into creative writing. And so I decided this has been on my heart for a really long time to write this book. It's loosely based on a family story, a family-lore that has kind of been passed on to me that I wanted to explore. And even though it's fiction, it does have a lot of roots In real life, things that happened, and some of my ancestors.
Katie Wolf 1:58
That's so cool. And what is your book called?
Layla Essary 2:04
My book is called bluff. And it sort of a has different meanings to it based on the different perspectives and the plot, you know, that I've chosen. And it's, it's based in 19, late 1930s, early 1940s, pre World War Two, in Mississippi, primarily in Mississippi, I do have my characters go to different places across the country, but it's based in the Deep South.
Katie Wolf 2:31
Nice, nice. And you talked a little bit about kind of your your connection to this story. But what made you want to write this book specifically, and tell this story,
Layla Essary 2:43
like I said, it's been on heart for a long time. And a few years ago, there was an exhibit that took place in one of this museum, they call the two museums in Jackson, Mississippi. And it was a deep exploration of the prohibition history in Mississippi. And the more I started thinking about that, and my personal connection to my great uncle who died during this time of prohibition, I just knew that something was really calling me to tell the story. And so I went to that exhibit and got to see, you know, right after Prohibition was repealed nationwide, in the early 1930s, all the way to 1966, when Mississippi, finally repealed Prohibition, but that we were the last one by many, many years, in some cases, when you look even the states around Mississippi. So it just gave me a lot of inspiration to write the story that hadbeen on my heart for a long time.
Katie Wolf 3:42
Mmmm I love that, yeah, it was so fascinating for me to get to work on this story kind of with you, because there was so much that I didn't know about prohibition, generally, andthis time period and Mississippi's history. So it was really fascinating for me to just learn about, you know, this time period through all of our all your hard work, all the research that you did, I got to benefit from it, and learn about this too. And you did a lot of research, do you want to talk a little bit about the research process and kind of what that was like to really, you know, make sure that you were portraying this time period and setting accurately.
Layla Essary 4:16
I would love to talk about that. Part of what was inspiring to me was to go to the Mississippi Archives and History, get a little card and go in there and try to find out about prohibition and look at a specific area that was known as the Gold Coast, which was outside of Jackson. It was east of Jackson and Rankin County, and this was along a river Pearl River. And it was where the bootleggers operated where the gambling halls were in full swing and where music was played. There's also an actual blues marker Mississippi blues marker that is on that location because the Gold Coast does not exist anymore. And for 40 something years it was a thriving hotbed of, there was lots of crime that takes place. But they're also honest, hardworking people who were running these operations. There was an even a black market tax that was placed on the alcohol in Mississippi. And so there was an actual system of taxing what was illegal in the state, which is all very interesting to me. There's a lot of articles that were written, obviously, in the local and in the Jackson newspaper in the Rankin County newspapers. And so that, you know, I did a deep dive on that research, but also talking to people who lived in that area. And hearing them from an historical standpoint, talk about the research, they had done I talked to a couple of historians, and to really get those oral histories is also very interesting.
Katie Wolf 5:46
Yeah, yeah, there's so much great history that you have access to just being where you are, and being able to get access to all of these primary sources, and also the oral histories and hear from people what this really was like. Did you find it challenging, like kind of knowing when to stop researching and start writing or kind of the balance between the research and the actual writing part?
Layla Essary 6:11
It really was, because even before I started working with you, I had done a lot of research, and listened to a lot of, there's even some podcasts or some things that are just underground, kind of, you know, blogs and things like that, that I had looked at. And every time I would think about just actually forcing myself to start telling this story, I was having so much fun doing the research that my discipline with the creative writing, I had some scenes written here, and there's this hodgepodge of activity that I'd go into some, you know, great creative inspiration period, but then that wouldn't last very long. My inspiration would go right to, oh, I'm not ready yet. I've got more research I need to do. I've got all these sources, I need to look up, I'm not ready to tell that story. And so that's when, you know, working with you has helped me to kind of stop and say, okay, that part is great that I've got this this history that I've looked into, but there's also a story I'm dying to tell.
Katie Wolf 7:08
Yeah, yeah, I think that's one of the hardest parts, especially for people even even for people who are writing other genres, like not necessarily historical fiction, but just knowing when to stop doing the preparation, and the foundational work and when to actually start writing, like when to say, Okay, I've done all I need to do, I can always do more later, but like, I've got to, I've got to sit down and do it, you know?
Layla Essary 7:29
so interesting, you say that I've shared with you about the Mississippi Book Festival, which is always in August. And I got to go to that this past year and listen to with the whole new set of eyes and ears, to some artist and some writers that had talked about their historical fiction projects. And that was one of the primary questions that they were asked is, How long did it take you to write it? How did you sort of force yourself out of research mode to get in there and do your creative writing? And it was something I have to say, out of all the questions, that was one of the most universal challenges for those writers.
Katie Wolf 8:10
And it could be easy, especially if you're really enjoying the research, like it could be easy to just keep doing going down these these, you know, different paths with it forever, almost, because it's so interesting.
Layla Essary 8:20
It is and, you know, my project really looks at these articles and includes loosely based articles, newspaper articles on those historical things that happened. And even our dialogue back and forth. There have been times where I would share something that I thought this has to be part of the book, this really happened. And if some of it was just outrageous, honestly, it just outrageous to imagine that these things happened in this timeframe that like I said, around the late 1930s. And that it did and so there were times that you even challenged me like this is even you might be going down a rabbit trail. I'm like the rabbit trails real like this really happened there.
Katie Wolf 8:59
Yeah, yeah, there's so much interesting stuff it Yeah, it's wild things that happened, that area in that time period.
Layla Essary 9:07
And writers and historians that even called it the Wild Wild West, you know, they said they would call it the Wild West, you know, because it had some interesting dynamics of things that happened and shoot outs and you know, just this battle between law enforcement, it's a losing battle. It felt like at times with the bootleggers in the gambling halls.
Katie Wolf 9:28
Yeah. Let's kind of shift over to this process overall of writing your book. So what made you want to hire a writing coach to help you in the process of writing this book?
Layla Essary 9:42
Well, I didn't even know I wanted to, but I found your podcast and I started listening to it. And that was really in this discovery phase of just needing somebody to listen to so I was out there just sort of looking for people and voices and finding ways to say hey, you know, I don't know how to do So I'm going to look to the people who do, and I found your podcast. And so the more I started listening to it and understanding that I needed some framework, and some accountability, it became very interesting to me. So I explored it thought about it. And initially, when you said you had some time to work with me, I was like, I'm not gonna do that. I can do this on my own. And so I walked away. I don't even know if it was even more than a week, I can't remember. But I know that I walked away and then instantly felt that I had to do it, because it was going to be what I needed to get the framework of my book and to have that discipline and accountability. And I just, I'm human that way. I've got a full time, work, consulting business, and all the other things of having a family and having children and all the things. I just needed that. And so that's my decision making process.
Katie Wolf 10:55
Yeah, yeah, that's a huge part of why I think working with a coach, whether it's me or someone else, like just having that structure and having that accountability is huge. Having someone to keep you on track. Having somebody give you deadlines, having somebody to check in with like, that's, that can be huge.
Layla Essary 11:13
And it was yeah, it's just one of those things that is such a vulnerable place to finally go. Okay, I'm gonna go for what's out here things I don't even have developed yet. And put myself out there even with you. It felt very vulnerable. But it was it just felt like the right thing to do. Why not? Let's try this.
Katie Wolf 11:32
Yeah, it is. And I think that's something that isn't talked about enough like that feeling of letting someone else see your work for the first time, early pages too that aren't necessarily fully fleshed out. Like, that's a big step to let someone in and share that with them. That's a big step.
Layla Essary 11:49
It really was. It was terrifying. Yeah, I just because I'm so inclined to think everybody is, you know, in terms of, I'm my own worst critic. And so I knew that they were not great when I started but I was just, I felt like I had an initial concept of where I wanted to start it. And so for me to put it out there and just started getting it snowballed. You know, it started this started putting together this, you know, this next scene started coming together. And, you know, I didn't have it all planned out when I started, and it really that first segment of pages that I sent to you, that was the hardest part of the whole process.
Katie Wolf 12:31
It's like, once you get over that initial hump, then it's like, okay, okay, I can do this, it kind of like reassures your nervous system a little bit, like, Okay, this is safe, I can do this, it will help my book,
Layla Essary 12:42
Even worse than even in college, because even in the creative writing classes, you knew you were getting a grade, you knew they were gonna pull out that red pen. And that was their job was to really tear it up and tell you all the things you've, you know, you've done wrong. And so that's not what those first phases were about for you. It's about giving me some framework. Now, there were some things that you were able to point out that were trends or, you know, some nuances to my writing that I needed to be aware of in terms of point of view, and some things like that. So it did give me enough awareness of how I was writing and things I was doing that were mistakes, that I didn't come through and write 90,000 words and make the same mistakes. So that was really great. But it wasn't like you were circling every single, you know, misspelling and things like that. So that it's really that was very helpful. And I guess reassuring.
Katie Wolf 13:38
Yeah, yeah, there's, there's so much fear, and kind of like, I don't know, almost anxiety, but that like clients have when they work with me, and I'm not the type of coach or they're not, not the type of person where I'm just going to tear things to shreds. Like, it doesn't I don't think that's my role. I don't think that's helpful. You know, it's, we really tend to be as writers, we tend to be like, our worst critics, like you were saying, we are very critical. We don't need someone else being that critical voice in our ear as well. And so the coach more role is more like helping you kind of shape things and pointing things out and talking through things instead of just like, this is all terrible tear it to shreds, you know?
Layla Essary 14:18
Yeah, I guess if I, if I had not heard some of those initial what is the word Katie, they're just there were some patterns with some mistakes that you know, I consider them mistakes, but they were just some things I needed to be aware of and be mindful of, so that I didn't continue to do them throughout. And those are the things that I thought that was part of the efficiency of why one of the values I think of working with a coach because you're gonna write this early segment and you're gonna get it as a coach, I would think, you know, you get this little view of their writing style, their voice, their tendencies and all this but there's also some things you're going to see that you know, if you did this for 400 pages and you then had to go back and make all those, those corrections, I just can imagine that that would be a little more discouraging than, you know, being mindful of it. And it really helps you. I felt like it helped me be a better writer.
Katie Wolf 15:15
Yeah. And that's something that every writer has, like, you know, it's it's every writer has patterns or default modes that they go into where sometimes they're not even aware that they're doing things I have that in my own writing, where I go back and like, Oh, why I did this thing, I did this thing. And all of my characters are doing this. So it is helpful to have someone kind of help you spot those things early on, like you were saying, so that you don't get to the end and realize, oh, wait a second, I've got some massive adjustments that I have to make. Because yeah, like you said, that can be that can be kind of discouraging.
Layla Essary 15:52
Absolutely.
Katie Wolf 15:55
What was if you think about the process of us working together and you writing this book, what do you think was the most enjoyable part of it? And then what was the hardest part? And you've touched on kind of some some difficult parts already, as far as, you know, turning your work over to someone and all of that, but what do you think was the most enjoyable and what was the hardest part of the process?
Layla Essary 16:16
The most enjoyable was learning my own writing, practice. In other words, I came up with this system of being able to allow myself I love to write longhand. But I knew the efficiency of typing. And I've always been, I've never done longhand with my work writing. So I don't know why I enjoy. I do love letter writing. And that is a component. We'll talk about the plot later. But you know, even some of my book has letters and has journal entries. And all that has always been something that I love to do, you know, with, with the actual, you know, written word. And so when I'm creative, I love being able to do all that. And so I've learned my own system of just getting time away and knowing that I've got to work through an upcoming scene. And so I would just do longhand, sometimes it would be just sketching and imagining and arrows, and somebody else would look at it and think that's not even writing. What is this? But for me, it made sense. It gave me the freedom to get through that scene, scratch things out. Put two things that could happen. And this is it, you know, and then I would take that all those things that I worked out a membrane and on paper to my keyboard, and actually took it to that next level and got that scene out. And sometimes I didn't have to do that sometimes that was just flowing, I could sit there at my computer had no problem. But when I would reach those, I guess those walls and those hurdles in my brain and you know, when I would get stuck, that would be the way I'd get unstuck was to you know, embrace that part of me that loves to write things out. So that was part of both the difficult thing and how, you know, the enjoyable thing all in one thing, if that makes sense.
Katie Wolf 18:01
Yeah, totally. And I think that's, that's something that was so great about you in the beginning. Well, throughout really is that you were willing to experiment and figure out a routine that works for you and like discover, how you write and what works best for you and trying different things and being like, Okay, this works. This doesn't let me try this, like, you were just really game for experimenting with, you know, discovering what works best for you. And I think that's something that every new writer kind of has to go through to figure out what's going to work for you what's going to work best. And I think that is my favorite.
Layla Essary 18:35
Yeah, it really is one of the things I feel like is the most fun is being able when you were challenging me to really understand the characters and to do character profiles. We delve a little bit into the Enneagram, which is something that I'm hold very close to my heart. But of course, I know the ones, like close to my family, you know, the people that I love the most, I know them really well. And I knew their Enneagram numbers, but somehow, through this experience I created a main character, that was an Enneagram number that I had not really ever studied, and said together with your coaching, we kind of delved into her Enneagram number, which was a five and you actually have people very close to you that are fives. And so by doing that you were able to watch my main character, Lizzie go through the process of evolving and going through great trauma, and to see how she would handle scenarios and what would be true to that character. That was something that was just such an epiphany for me to go through the process. I'm not, I'm sure that wouldn't work for everybody. But for me understanding the Enneagram helped me make a richer story and richer characters, I think.
Katie Wolf 19:45
Yeah, I completely agree. I think that was one of the most enjoyable works for me. If I think about working with you. It was so fun. I've never done that with a client like really dived into the Enneagram to think through who these people are and how they would respond. onto things and how they their relationships, like, what would their relationships be like. And it really did make the final version stronger. Like they're your characters are so strong, it's one of the strongest parts of the book, in addition to the time and the place and the setting, the characters are so strong, and I think it is because we were willing to spend some time to really get to know these people who they were
Layla Essary 20:25
Yeah, and it fascinating that your brain can create something, and can create a person that I don't know that I even have ever met. And that was really fun to realize that I don't know if I've ever met her, Lizzie, like that. Or maybe I have, and I'm just not aware of it. But you are also able to say, wait a minute, that may not be accurate. I can't imagine her doing X, Y, or Z. So let's stop and think about that. Not to say it's wrong, but just really think about the integrity of that scene, would that be something she would do? And almost every time, you know, that came up, and it was only a couple of times, but it was I was like, Oh, you're totally, right. That would not be what she would do. That's not how she would respond. So it gave me some parameters to work through and my characters to know if their truest sense. And I'll just say that, you know, if you're a number, you could never act a certain way. Because you're, you're five, you could never do something that's not at all what this is about. It just was, you know, the very essence of who she is. Questioning- Was it accurate? Could this be really thought about in a different way? That was very effective?
Katie Wolf 21:36
Yeah, yeah, it was, it's something that I'm going to kind of keep in my back pocket for my own writing, actually, to do some exploration with this new book I'm writing about, like, what are, How can I bring the Enneagram into this and really think through who these people are. So thank you for giving me that.
Layla Essary 21:53
You're so welcome, glad I could help.
Katie Wolf 21:57
So what was the experience? Like of working with me as a coach, just generally, you know, you've shared a little bit about the process and kind of what you learned. But yeah, just do you have any other thoughts about kind of what it was like to work with a coach, and if it was different than what you expected?
Layla Essary 22:14
It was really about the discipline, the fact that I could plan out in the midst of a very busy workweek, family life, things I do for fun, all of those things. And to be aware that there was there was this underlying deadline is what it was for me, because I've worked under deadlines as a journalist for a long time. And I made my deadlines. And so for me having those, those goals, really, I could not have gotten through almost 90,000 words, in this timeframe, I can't imagine having accomplished that, without some parameters. And to be able to say to you, I'm really struggling, you know, I've got this process is working with the long hand and going to my keyboard. But I've got two pathways, and I'm having a really hard time getting it through it. And it just to be able to have that sounding board was fascinating, because you were able to say, I'm not gonna tell you what to do. But I can also say, you're on the right path. This makes a lot of sense. Let's think about this. And that that daily, you know, dialogue during the week when I was in my writing process, really helped me to get to that end goal.
Katie Wolf 23:28
Mm hmm. Yeah. Yeah, I think that's one of the biggest kind of benefits to having someone who can keep you on track, but also really knows the story, and can be someone who can talk back and forth with you about plot issues or character issues, or whatever it might be. And what would you say for someone who is considering working with a coach for their book that they're not sure, what would you say to them?
Layla Essary 23:58
I've had people ask me about that. I've got a couple of friends who are looking at book projects. And they've heard me talk about the benefits of this and you know, the discipline pathway and all the in, they really have have thought about this in a whole different ways, because they're doing the same thing I did before where, you know, written an outline, and they're throwing some scenes down, but to actually go through and, you know, even the process of giving you say, let's say it's 15 pages, and I surrender that to you to get to look over it's also provides a little bit of a break, because I would take a break during that time, I wouldn't do any writing for those windows of time while you were reviewing and I think that was something I never really thought about either. When I thought about writing a book in six months, I thought, well, it's gotta be every single day like it's gonna be I'm gonna have to be digging in there and do it which is great to think about, you know, consistent writing pattern that's wonderful. But it was also nice you know i told my friends that it was nice to kind of turn it To over for a while and sort of live in those scenes and think about what was coming up next. And that was something I told them was very beneficial as well.
Katie Wolf 25:09
Yeah, yeah, those breaks are so important. mental breaks. And also just like stepping back from the story. I think even doing that in little bursts of time, like little windows can help you approach the story in a different way or make you feel fresh. And yeah, that's important.
Layla Essary 25:28
Yeah. And, you know, I talked in the beginning about some of the letters and the journals and things that I incorporated with this book. And I even took the letters that Mike, so the story, do you want me to talk about that?
Katie Wolf 25:41
Yeah, that was gonna be our next question. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, awesome.
Layla Essary 25:43
So my great uncle died in the mid to late 30s. And he was a gambler, and a traveling salesman. And he never made it home after one night of being in this Gold Coast area. And my great aunt always believed that there was foul play involved, but his death was ruled accidental. And so that is sort of the premise of the book is imagining what it would been like to think through, you know, all the possibilities to examine what that investigation, how it was handled, and how it could have been handled. And so that is sort of the premise of it. And that was inspired to write it. I talked about a little bit about the exhibit about prohibition, but also my great uncle, all these letters that he had written during the courtship with my great aunt Lizzie. During their, their days of being married, she kept all those letters. And so near their beautiful fountain pen letters with this amazing handwriting, his penmanship was just gorgeous. And so it's still tough to read, sometimes, you know, just the way that he wrote. And I kind of dug into this a few years ago, and just was amazed by all these places that he went, and how he wrote her from these hotels all over the south. And then, you know, there was this letter this way, there were postcards and letters, and then there was his last one. And so I always that planted that little seed of what really happened to my great uncle William. And that's really what inspired me to write this story.
Katie Wolf 27:22
I love that I love the image of you have like looking at these letters and being able to touch them and look at the penmanship and, and the letters that are included in the book. What what's in there, for me, that was one of the most enjoyable parts, you really captured the voice of, you know, what someone how someone in this time period would have written it, they felt very much like real letters.
Layla Essary 27:49
Yeah. Which is great to hear. Because, you know, and I didn't even finish my thought, but I put those letters away while I was writing. During our coaching period, I put those letters away and just kept myself from like an atom because I thought they're in my brain. I know, generally, the way he talks. Of course, they're one way I don't have, unfortunately, I have her letters to him. They're just the letters that he wrote to her. And so, you know, after I had kind of gotten that final manuscript for you to review, I went and pulled them all out and just kind of let them speak to me, it's a fresh, you know, the end. And it's, it's interesting, I thought, Oh, I kind of did write that letter, I sort of did this letter and I did that postcard. So it just imagining what she was like. And even though I knew my grade, and until I was about 11, or 12. She actually lived in my childhood home. And so I spent a lot of time with by great aunt, Lizzie, but she was much later in her life. And so, you know, I'm just imagining what she was like, in a much later, I mean, a much earlier stage of her life.
Katie Wolf 28:53
Yeah, yeah. I would have loved to meet Lizzie and to have lunch with her, And sit outside on the porch. Yeah.
Layla Essary 28:59
And drink her SassaFrass tea Yes, yes, you make lunch for us every Sunday. That was just part of what we she had a little apartment on our house and she lived independently even though she lived in the house with us. She had her own bathroom and living quarters and kitchen. And so she kind of did her own thing. And then on Sundays we would have and I can still taste her cornbread. Like I can taste that SassaFrass tea I can taste this fresh vegetables from my daddy's garden that she would you know make Sunday dinner and so it just have those images and those thoughts and memories in my sister's remember her a lot more vividly because they are older than me and they they grew up really spending a lot of time when she was younger and things like that. So they have a whole different perspective and and probably much richer appreciation for her as a person than I even remember.
Katie Wolf 29:51
But at least you got some of those years with her.
Katie Wolf 29:54
That's right! That's right!
Katie Wolf 29:57
So what is next for your book? We finished working together, tell me where things are at right now with it.
Layla Essary 30:05
Well, I, of course, got my manuscript back from you and have some suggestions and some assignments. So I'm still working on really finishing the story. And I'm actually working with a local sheriff, here in Mississippi who is willing to look at my manuscript. And even before he looks at the actual manuscript, he said, I can meet with him to kind of go through some of my questions about the legal system and what would have been, you know, an investigatory process and what might be something in terms of trials and things like that. So, and he's just he reached out to me to say, anything I can do to help you. And I'm like, Okay, be careful with that, because I'm actually gonna call you up and do that. So that's some of what I have to do is just some logistic work to make some final decisions about a few scenes. But yeah, even since you've given it back to me, I've done a lot of work on it. So I'm getting close. So I just have to push through and finish.
Katie Wolf 31:04
Yay, the end is so in sight. Tell me about the feeling. So yes, there's still some tweaking and revising to do but you have written a book, I mean, it's 90,000 words, roughly, it's a book you've written a book. Tell me about the feeling, when you think about the fact that I wrote a book? How does that feel?
Layla Essary 31:23
It is amazing. I mean, it's one of those things that even having printed of course it's not finished, like you said, so I got some things to do on it. But even having that printed version in your hands, and just that feeling of accomplishment. And, you know, it's it's kind of emotional to think about going through a process of writing something that is strictly based on your imagination of real life people. And a real life time, in a setting of a place that was, it was well documented, has been written about, from all these different perspectives. I mean, there's been national publications during that time, where they talked about things happening in Mississippi, which is crazy to think about. And so I feel a lot of responsibility about that. Because from what I can tell from people, you know, sources that I trust, that there's never been a fiction account of the Gold Coast ever written, that responsibility rests very heavy on my shoulders to really feel like that I could give this to that historian that I worked with who actually went to the Mississippi archives in history and found a whole article about my great uncle, I had never even found and affirmed me in my exploration process, because I'm imagining these things. And he's like, Well, everything you're questioning, it's very accurate. And here's why. And he pushes this document toward me. And I thought, you know, every time I've had those little affirmations, it has just been it, it just made me so proud that, you know, this time and this time, you know, this very time it was when I was supposed to write this. And I'm very excited to see how it all plays out. I hope it finds its way into the hands of the publisher. And that's, of course, my hope and dream and prayer right now. So that's the next phase of work for me.
Katie Wolf 33:16
Yes. And it really does feel like only you could tell the story. Like the time, yes. But also you, you were the person to write this book.
Layla Essary 33:27
that's really great. It feels that way, too. I mean, I really do feel that way. And, you know, just a feel very connected to the scenes. And that because I mean, even it went away before I was born. But I do know, like my sisters, and I heard my mom talk about this place. And these, you know, where it was across the river, and there's just, you know, you talk to people of a certain generation, they will just sit down and said, Let me tell you about that place. Oh, you wouldn't believe this place, and everybody has a story of this place. I mean, you still think about Beale Street in Memphis, or you think about the French Quarter in New Orleans. You can kind of imagine what those things were like, because you can still go to those places, right? And imagine what prohibition that will those little periods of prohibition must have been like in these iconic places. And this place was just as iconic in Mississippi, but it's no longer exists.
Katie Wolf 34:22
Yeah. So do you have plans for a second book, anything you can share with us once Bluff is polished and ready. Any plans for a second book.
Layla Essary 34:34
I definitely do have inspiration for a second book. And it's something that actually was something I debated about doing from the beginning and thought, Okay, this is a story that someone mind the story of my great aunt, you know, that's really about her. And that part of my family's history that I've heard about and been passed on. And the story that I'm thinking about doing is is based on my own personal experience and things that that I witnessed and saw and lived through as an eight and nine year old. And so that is going to be the topic and the thing, my next project I really, really want to write about. So kind of not ready to talk about it yet. But I'm just excited that I'm already thinking about that next project. So maybe I'll get to work with you again.
Katie Wolf 35:18
Yes, I would love that. I'm so excited about it just a possibility even a little bit that you've shared with me. I think it makes sense as your next project.
Layla Essary 35:28
Good. So, yeah, I think that one's going to be something it's going to be a little, this wasn't even this this first. But even with, like I said, it'd be in secondary characters and other people's lives and their experiences, it still had a lot of emotion for me, because I even could think through the fact that my mom was so close to my great aunt and she spent so much time as a child, she would take her in, and she had a safe place to land at my great aunt's house, and she had such great value to my mom. So that that was really personal for me to think about. What an extraordinary woman that she never had, had children of her own, but she, she was such a powerful influence on my own mother. And so that was, you know, that was personal for me. But this one is going to be different, because it's really about things that I've witnessed and saw. So that makes it exciting.
Katie Wolf 36:19
Well, I'll be sure to pass on any updates to everyone listening about bluff and keep them posted. Thank you so much for coming on the podcast and talking about your book and your experience working with me. I really enjoyed talking with you about it. I think everyone will get a lot of value out of hearing this too.
Layla Essary 36:35
Well, I'm excited to really put this out in the world but I really want to say thank you, Katie, because your influence and even some of our monthly you know, Zoom calls, you know, just life was crazy and sometimes i'd get on there and i'd be disheveled or late just your patience and your calming influence, even when I would just be frustrated at my lack of progress because I think everybody that goes through this whole process has you know, it's a roller coaster, its ups and downs and but you are such a light during this process. And I'm just so grateful for everything you helped me accomplish.
Katie Wolf 37:12
Oh, thank you so much. You're so sweet. All right. Thanks for listening everyone.